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August 22, 2025
SALLY SARA: Less red tape, faster home builds, and embracing artificial intelligence. These were some of the hot topics during the three day Economic Reform Summit in Canberra. The Treasurer, Jim Chalmers, has described the event as a major success, noting that both participants and the government still have a lot of work to do. Joining me now is James Paterson, Shadow Minister for Finance and Liberal Senator for Victoria. Senator, welcome back to Breakfast.
SENATOR JAMES PATERSON: Thank you for having me.
SALLY SARA: The Economic Roundtable was it just a talkfest in the end, or was it a worthwhile exercise?
SENATOR JAMES PATERSON: Look, I always think it is a worthwhile exercise to recognise the actual problems that we have in the economy. And the Treasurer himself has said that our economy is not productive enough, it's not resilient enough, and our budget is not sustainable. But my concern is that after three days in Canberra, we're not really much closer to solving any of those problems. There were some good ideas discussed, but very little concrete in the way of adopting them, or implementing them. I mean, we've agreed that red tape is a problem, but I don't think we're any closer to actually dealing with that problem.
SALLY SARA: There was a heated exchange in the roundtable between Treasurer Jim Chalmers and Shadow Treasurer Ted O'Brien on spending and fiscal discipline. Did the Shadow Treasurer attend the summit with the intention to genuinely collaborate?
SENATOR JAMES PATERSON: Yes, he did. And even Labor ministers and MPs, including Clare O'Neil yesterday on Afternoon Briefing on the ABC, recognised the constructive contribution that Ted O'Brien made. But he also wasn't there just to be a rubber stamp and to not contest ideas. I think it's ok to disagree, and it's ok to debate ideas. And we are concerned that government spending is on an unsustainable trajectory under Jim Chalmers. And he himself has even conceded that. I mean, the data is very clear from the budget papers. This financial year will be the highest level of government spending as a proportion of the economy since 1986, outside a pandemic or recession. Now, that is an extraordinary increase in government spending in the government's first term. They increased spending by about 6% a year when the economy only grew by about 2% a year, and we've got to fix that if we're going to fix the budget.
SALLY SARA: The Treasurer, Jim Chalmers, says there's consensus on the principles for tax reform. If the government puts forward proposed laws that are in line with those principles, will you be a barrier to those reforms, or will you support them?
SENATOR JAMES PATERSON: Well, we're up for a conversation about tax reform. We agree there are inefficiencies in our tax system that could be improved, but we are mindful of the fact that the Prime Minister himself said only a week ago that the Labor Party will only do in this term, on tax, what they took to the election, and they did not take tax increases to the election. No Australian voted for higher taxes at the election. And so it seems that Jim Chalmers isn't on the same page as the Prime Minister because he was unwilling to repeat that commitment at his press conference yesterday, and he is leaving open the door to higher taxes, particularly on people's retirement savings, or on family trusts, on a whole range of other things. When those questions were raised during the election campaign, Jim Chalmers and the Labor Party said that it was a Liberal Party scare campaign. So if they go ahead and try and increase taxes, that will be a major breach of faith with the Australian people.
SALLY SARA: You're listening to Radio National Breakfast, where I'm joined by the Shadow Finance Minister, Senator James Paterson. Senator, what do you make of the informal agreement between the ACTU and the Tech Council to ensure the content of creative workers, journalists, and academics is properly recognised by AI platforms? ACTU Secretary Sally McManus has called it a breakthrough. Is that your view?
SENATOR JAMES PATERSON: I think it is a positive step, and I do welcome it, and I encourage tech companies, particularly AI companies that are using this intellectual property or would like to use this intellectual property to do exactly that, to reach arrangements on commercial terms with people who've created that intellectual property to compensate them for using it. I think that's much better than government regulating or legislating in this area in a way that could unintentionally stop and impede the rollout of artificial intelligence in Australia.
SALLY SARA: One of the outcomes has been an agreement to develop options for a national road user charge for electric vehicles. When and how does the Coalition think that it should be introduced?
SENATOR JAMES PATERSON: Our Shadow Minister for Infrastructure, Bridget McKenzie, has been talking about this problem for a number of years. And everybody agrees that it is not fair that some road users who fill up their car with petrol and diesel pay the costs of maintaining roads, and some road uses who have an EV don't contribute to that cost. And so that is an issue which needs to be recognised. We want to see the details here, and it will involve cooperation with the states. It sounds like it's not something that's going to come very quickly, but we'll consider on its merits any proposal that the government brings forward.
SALLY SARA: Just finally, Benjamin Netanyahu has said that Anthony Albanese has tarnished his legacy with Australia's position on Palestinian statehood and the denial of visas for a couple of Israeli politicians. What should the government do in your view to restore the relationship with Israel?
SENATOR JAMES PATERSON: Well, I think the first point is recognising that it needs to be restored. And I'm not sure the Prime Minister or the Foreign Minister agree. I think they think it's going fine. But the Australia-Israel relationship is at the worst place it has been since the creation of the state of Israel in 1948. And that is not in our national interest because Israel is a liberal democracy and an important intelligence partner to Australia, who has provided intelligence to disrupt terrorist attacks on Australian soil in the past, as well as protecting our deployed soldiers in the Middle East. So the first step is recognising and admitting you've got a problem. And then the second thing I think would be reining in loose ministers like Tony Burke, who on Radio National this week engaged in an incredibly reckless and inflammatory rhetoric at the worst possible time, both domestically and internationally. We need to be turning down the temperature, not turning it up, and I don't think Tony Burke contributed to that.
SALLY SARA: You don't think we should push back?
SENATOR JAMES PATERSON: Well, we're entitled absolutely to push back and defend our Prime Minister, and I respect the intent of a Labor colleague to want to defend the Prime Minister, but to use the inflammatory language that Tony Burke used, I think, was grossly irresponsible. We have an antisemitism crisis in this country, we have people trying to set synagogues on fire and burn them to the ground, and the Home Affairs Minister is responsible for domestic national security and social cohesion, and I do not think it helps social cohesion to use the kind of inflammatory language that he did. I think he should frankly apologise.
SALLY SARA: Is social cohesion at home more important than calling out people being left hungry in Gaza and the number of civilian deaths in Gaza from the conflict as well?
SENATOR JAMES PATERSON: Well, Sally, as you know, on this program with you, I have called that out, too. And there are ways that you can call that out that are measured and calm and consistent with Australia's values and our national interest, and there are irresponsible ways of doing it. And I thought it was very clear that Tony Burke was across that line, and it's telling that not a single one of his Labor colleagues has joined him in that rhetoric. And Josh Burns, a Labor MP, has unusually felt the need to publicly call Tony Burke out. Tony's predecessor, Clare O'Neil, often spoke about the need to be calm and measured and lower the tone at a time of heightened community tensions, and he did the opposite in a reckless and indulgent way on your program this week.
SALLY SARA: But even we've seen some Jewish organisations writing to the Israeli Prime Minister saying that Benjamin Netanyahu's comments had actually gone too far.
SENATOR JAMES PATERSON: And I think they were right to do so. I think Benjamin Netanyahu is entitled to protect his own position as well. But I don't think it's been constructive to the Australia-Israel relationship, the contribution he's made, or the public debate here in Australia. But I note that this is not the first time that foreign leaders have criticised Australian Prime Ministers. Infamously, Emmanuel Macron criticised Scott Morrison, and that was received very differently by the Labor Party and in some sections of the media. So I think we should be consistent and principled here. We should be measured in our contributions, both in domestic political debate and international relations.
SALLY SARA: Senator Paterson, thank you for your time on Breakfast this morning.
SENATOR JAMES PATERSON: Thank you for having me.
ENDS