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December 30, 2025
BARBARA MILLER: Prime Minister Anthony Albanese has released terms of reference for a review into the Bondi Beach terror attack to probe the actions of law enforcement and intelligence agencies. But the government continues to sidestep calls for a full Commonwealth Royal Commission, with Home Affairs Minister Tony Burke yesterday arguing it could do more harm than good.
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THE HON TONY BURKE MP: I've been deeply concerned in terms of social cohesion when you think through some of the terms of reference that have been circulated for other forms of inquiry, where the necessary outcome would be to re-platform and provide a public platform for some of the worst statements and the worst voices, to effectively relive some of the worst examples of antisemitism over the last two years.
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BARBARA MILLER: James Paterson is the Shadow Minister for Finance. Welcome back to Breakfast.
SENATOR JAMES PATERSON: Good to be with you.
BARBARA MILLER: What do you make of that argument, James Paterson from Tony Burke, that this would platform hate, a federal royal commission?
SENATOR JAMES PATERSON: I think it's a patronising, presumptuous, and offensive argument that has been directly and explicitly rejected by the families of the victims of the Bondi terrorist attack. It's also been rejected by Jewish community leaders across Australia who understand the risk to a royal commission but nonetheless want to proceed with it because they think it's important to get to the bottom of these issues. I think it also fundamentally misunderstands how royal commissions work. They are not an open mic night. Every person who wants to make a submission doesn't necessarily get to have their submission published, and every person who wants to appear as a witness doesn't get to appear to give evidence. I think it's inconceivable that a sensible, appropriately appointed royal commissioner would ask an Islamist extremist or a neo-Nazi to come and give evidence and platform their views. But frankly, it's also, to put it politely, a newfound concern from Tony Burke. I mean, this government has presided over two and a half years of platforming the worst hate incitement towards the Jewish community that we've ever seen in our country, and it's done very little to address that. So to have this as an excuse for not having a royal commission just doesn't wash with the Opposition. It certainly doesn't watch with the Jewish community.
BARBARA MILLER: You said that the government fears its own failings and inaction would be exposed by a royal commission before any review has been undertaken. Are you clear what those failings in your view are?
SENATOR JAMES PATERSON: Yes, I think it's been clear from the 8th of October, when we had a rally in Western Sydney, where an imam said that this is a day of celebration and a day of pride, that the Prime Minister has failed to grasp the seriousness of the antisemitism crisis. Almost everything the government has eventually done on antisemitism they've had to be dragged kicking and screaming to doing by the Jewish community, by the media and the opposition. Things like banning the public display of flags of listed terrorist organisations, they had to be dragged into doing. Things like toughening our incitement to violence laws federally, because no hate preacher had been prosecuted, they had to be dragged kicking and screaming to do. Things like toughening our visa screening and cancellation powers for the Home Affairs Minister, the Jewish community and the Opposition have been calling for over a year, and finally, only after Bondi, they've done it. So it's very clear that even the things the Albanese government has done on this have been too little and too late, and there are many things that they are yet to do.
BARBARA MILLER: You also said the government was gaslighting the victims of Bondi, pretty emotive language. What exactly did you mean by that?
SENATOR JAMES PATERSON: Well, I've used that terminology, but much more important than me, families of victims and rabbis have used that language too. And what I meant by that is, yesterday at this press conference, Tony Burke implied that you couldn't have a judge oversee a royal commission because it was too sensitive. I mean, that displays either breathtaking ignorance of the history of the intelligence community or willful gaslighting of the Jewish community and survivors, because judges are exactly the kind of people that we appoint to oversee royal commissions into the intelligence community. In fact, Labor governments, the Whitlam government and the Hawke government, appointed Justice Hope to conduct two royal commissions into the intelligence community. Tony Burke also implied that he couldn't have a royal commission into the intelligence committee because it was too sensitive and it might be public. Again, in our history, on multiple occasions, we've appointed former judges to hold inquiries into the intelligence community, and they've handled that. At this very time, this very day, there are judges who will be considering applications for warrants from the Federal Police for foreign interference, for espionage, and for terrorism. And they're briefed to highly sensitive classified material in order to grant those warrants. So if Tony Burke doesn't trust judges to do that, then he's actually arguing for a radically different justice system in Australia.
BARBARA MILLER: You're listening to Radio National Breakfast. I'm speaking with Federal Opposition front bencher James Paterson. And I'll just read you a text that's come in on the text line as we sort of continue with this discussion, I guess, every day about a royal commission. Given the government has repeatedly said now it won't be holding a royal commission, is the opposition simply politicising this tragedy by continuing with this request?
SENATOR JAMES PATERSON: No, I don't agree. And when he was in opposition, the Opposition Leader, Anthony Albanese, campaigned for many royal commissions. He's been in favour of royal commissions into the banking sector, into veterans, into disabilities, into the aged care sector, into Robodebt, and many other things. He even commissioned a former High Court judge to look into the Morrison Government's practise of appointing multiple ministries. All of those things apparently warranted a royal commission in Anthony Albanese's view, but our worst ever terror attack, which is the culmination of two and a half years of shocking antisemitism, doesn't justify a royal commission in his view. We're going to continue to hold his feet to the fire on this. We're going to hold him accountable for this. And we're going to stand with the Jewish community who are so clear from every representative body in the Jewish community, whether it is the Executive Council of Australian Jewry, whether it is the Zionist Federation, whether it is the Rabbinical Association, every single one of them is calling for a royal commission, along with the victims, and we stand with them.
BARBARA MILLER: The government has made its intentions very clear. Yesterday seemed to draw a line, I guess, under the question as far as they were concerned. Will you cooperate with the review and reserve judgement?
SENATOR JAMES PATERSON: As an opposition, I can't see any opportunity for us to have a meaningful say in the Richardson inquiry. It is an incredibly narrow and weak inquiry. The terms of reference don't even mention antisemitism, which I think is a shocking omission. It really is an inquiry into the intelligence community and the federal police, and the opposition doesn't have a formal role in either of those. And of course, it doesn't have royal commission powers, so it can't compel anyone to give evidence, it can compel any documents, and it'll be conducted completely in secret until hopefully it's eventually published. That's not adequate. It won't get to the bottom of this. And no disrespect to Dennis Richardson as an individual who's an eminent person, and the kind of person you could appoint to lead a royal commission, perhaps in conjunction with a judge or former judge, but this is not going to get to the bottom of the issue, and we don't think that's good enough.
BARBARA MILLER: Shortly, we're going to hear about the experience following New Zealand's terrorist attack of 2019 and the Royal Commission they conducted there. In New Zealand, parts of the evidence and transcripts were suppressed for 30 years to protect national security. Wouldn't that also be an issue here, potentially, and could that limit transparency?
SENATOR JAMES PATERSON: I'm concerned that's exactly what will happen with the Richardson inquiry, but I'm not concerned about that in a royal commission. In fact, it's one of the virtues of a royal commission is that it can decide what's appropriate to make public and what is appropriate to remain secret.
BARBARA MILLER: In New Zealand they decided that large parts of evidence should remain sealed for 30 years.
SENATOR JAMES PATERSON: Exactly, and that overcomes all the arguments and objections that Tony Burke was making yesterday at his press conference, that somehow a royal commission couldn't look into sensitive matters. I mean, the United States government held a commission of inquiry into 9-11, and many of the classified materials from that weren't published, and it's quite appropriate. We would never suggest that a royal commissioner should publish everything. We would ask that a royal commissioner use their judgment to decide what is appropriate to be public and what is proper to remain classified for a period of time. That's how royal commissions work, that's how the Hope Royal Commission worked, that's how every inquirer into our intelligence community has worked.
BARBARA MILLER: You don't think Dennis Richardson would be capable of doing that?
SENATOR JAMES PATERSON: I have no doubt that he will, but he doesn't have the powers of a royal commission. So he can't compel anyone to give evidence. He can't compel any documents to be provided. He can conduct any public hearings. He doesn't even have the resources that a royal commission has. He's going to have a small secretariat from the Department of Prime Minister and Cabinet. He won't have council assisting. He won't have researchers in the way that a royal commission does. It is just far too inadequate a response to such a serious event in Australia's history.
BARBARA MILLER: Just before I let you go, can I get your thoughts on the suggestion by the New South Wales Premier, Chris Minns, that the army could potentially be deployed to the streets of Sydney? Would you support that?
SENATOR JAMES PATERSON: Look, only the federal government can deploy the Australian Defence Force and if the Prime Minister has a serious proposal to do that, we will look at that carefully. But at the moment, there's no serious proposal on the table and I think we should focus on the things we actually can control, like getting to the bottom of the explosion of antisemitism in our country over the last two years, dealing with the hate preachers who've incited violence against the Jewish community and making sure we have no one in our country who thinks it's a good idea to incite violence against Jewish community, or carry out acts of violence against the Jewish community rather than just building ever higher fences, ever stronger walls and ever more security around Jewish institutions. The Jewish community tells me that they want to live in a country one day where that's no longer necessary. I think that's what we should work towards.
BARBARA MILLER: Would you then not support the arming of the Jewish Community Security Group? Another suggestion.
SENATOR JAMES PATERSON: Well, the Community Security Group is armed in certain circumstances at the moment. They have appropriately trained and licenced volunteers who are allowed to carry firearms under limited circumstances, and I think that is appropriate. But ultimately, the Jewish community shouldn't be asked to protect themselves. Ultimately, it's the job of the government to protect the Jewish community from these extremists. If we have people in our midst who want to conduct acts of violence towards the Jewish community, that is the problem. The Jewish community shouldn't be expected to defend themselves in perpetuity and provide their own security in perpetuity.
BARBARA MILLER: James Paterson, thank you so much for joining us.
SENATOR JAMES PATERSON: Thank you for having me.
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