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Transcripts
October 15, 2025
Tuesday, 15 October, 2025
Topics: Tom Hughes Oration, future of the Liberal Party
E&OE…………………………………………………………………………………………
MARK LEVY: James Paterson is the Shadow Minister for Finance, Government Services, and Public Service. He joins me on the line right now. Senator Paterson, good morning to you. You spoke last night at the Hughes Oration. You said this is a serious moment for the Liberal Party, we must learn how to campaign and communicate better, there's nothing defective with our values, and there's a time limit on this soul-searching process. It sounds to me, Senator Paterson, like you're a lot of conservative voters out there, you're a little bit sick and tired of the position that the Liberals find themselves in, and it's time to get going and make a dent in this government.
SENATOR JAMES PATERSON: Well, I'm hearing loud and clear from our members, from our supporters, from people who want to vote Liberal in Australia, that they want us to be the best opposition we can be, and they want us to get ourselves in a position where we can form government again. They don't want to see Anthony Albanese realise his dream of becoming the natural party of government at the federal level, and in order for us to do that, I think we do need to move on from the apology tour. We do need to resolve our internal differences. We must unite behind shared values. We must roll out a policy agenda which inspires trust and confidence in Australian people, and we must hold this government to account. The Albanese government has not got any better in their second term, nor will they if they get a third term or a fourth term.
MARK LEVY: Now, when it comes to the public therapy session that you alluded to, the mass therapy session in your speech last night, there's been a lot said in the wake of the election campaign. I mentioned that Senator Price and Mr. Hastie have been put on the backbench for some of the things that they've said and not falling into line with Sussan Ley. How do you move on as a party and get over this mass therapy session when we're still waiting months before we determine, well the Liberal Party determines, what the future looks like and what you actually stand for?
SENATOR JAMES PATERSON: Well, Andrew and Jacinta are two of my closest friends in the Parliament and I've said publicly I regret that they're on the backbench, but I respect the reason why they are there, and they've got a very important contribution to make to the future of our party. It's perfectly normal after the worst loss in our 81-year history to have a period of soul searching and public debate about our future, but it just can't go on forever because if we're still debating it closer to the next election, then we'll demonstrate that we're focused on ourselves and not the Australian people. They want us focused on them, and the problems in their lives. So that's why this process of uniting behind shared principles is critical. I don't think that the conservative-classical liberal fusion, which has served our party so well for 81 years, is fundamentally broken. And I think we need to be really careful at following the advice of people outside the Parliamentary Liberal Party who don't have our best interests in heart, who advocate really false choices for the Liberal Party that would make us unrecognisable from the party we've traditionally been.
MARK LEVY: Given you say that Senator Price and Mr. Hastie are two of your closest friends, have you heard from them today out of interest, given it seems like last night some of your speech was a bit of a swipe at them?
SENATOR JAMES PATERSON: It absolutely wasn't a swipe at them. It was about ideas, not personalities. And yes, I've been in touch with both of them today, and yesterday. I am almost every day with them because Andrew and I came together since we were first elected on our shared concern about the strategic environment Australia faces, and we've been in many trenches together. And Jacinta has been a friend of mine long before she was elected to parliament. I've been urging her to run for parliament and join the Liberal Party, and I'm delighted that she's done so.
MARK LEVY: Alright, you've also said that a turn towards a Farage-like populist agenda is likely not the way to go, pointing out that while polling is good now, and election is a different beast, what do you say to those who want to see a tilt in that direction?
SENATOR JAMES PATERSON: Well, one of the things that Nigel Farage is advocating is significantly increased government spending. He's advocating the nationalisation of the steel industry and utilities in the United Kingdom. Now, it's a matter for the UK if they want to go in that direction. But the Liberal Party was founded by Robert Menzies in part to oppose nationalisation of the banks by Ben Chifley, and to keep government limited and small so that people and the economy can be free, and I think we need to stick to those traditional principles that have given unprecedented prosperity to our country, but also seen the Liberal Party govern for about two-thirds of the time since we were founded in 1944.
MARK LEVY: You commented on the culture wars, your view there's battles that might fit that description but also have logic behind them and your party shouldn't look to just jump on any grievance or bandwagon to try and score a political point. Can you explain that a little further for us?
SENATOR JAMES PATERSON: Well, there are some people who say that the Liberal Party should just become like a free-market version of the Teals; we shouldn't participate in the so-called culture wars, we should just focus strictly on the economy. And while the economy should be the heart of our pitch, actually those cultural issues are very important to our country and our party and our supporters, and the Australian people agree with our views on those issues. Like we do, they support the flag. They support the anthem. They support the constitution. They support our ANZAC tradition. They support Australia Day. So, we should not shy away from those debates. If we did we would become a hollow, empty party. I think we should proudly defend those shared cultural institutions, and be proud to participate in those debates about identity and sovereignty.
MARK LEVY: There's a lot of frustration from my listeners, Senator, with respect, in terms of policy platforms, and it was communicated to me that we probably won't have any policy announcements until the new year. Can you confirm that, and can you afford to wait that long before communicating your platforms to the electorate?
SENATOR JAMES PATERSON: I hear people loud and clear in their frustration about that, but I guarantee them they'll be even more disappointed if we put out policies that were half-baked and did not withstand public scrutiny. Sometimes, in the last term, we did put things out before they were ready, they did not withstand public scrutiny, and they undermined our appeal to demonstrate we're a party of government and we're ready to govern again. We have to get it right.
MARK LEVY: But again, with respect though, Senator, and I don't want to be rude here, how long does it take you to put together a review and come up with some findings? I mean, it's been months since the last election, there was a review into the last election. I mean it seems like it's just review after review after review and we go nowhere, it is just this vicious circle that goes around and around in circles?
SENATOR JAMES PATERSON: I totally get that, and I totally hear you and others who have that concern and we will be putting some more meat on the bones in the coming months that will give people a better sense of the direction that we want to take. But we're going to do it in a responsible and methodical way. We're not going to rush into it as we sometimes did in the past that resulted in demonstrating that we weren't ready for government. That's the opposite of the message we want send. I think the first and most important thing is agree on direction and values, and unite behind that and then release policies which are consistent with that because when they're inconsistent they damage our standing and confuse our support.
MARK LEVY: Without wanting to be repetitive though, isn't this half the problem for you and the party though? This is part of the reason you're seeing support fall off for the party and for the leader Sussan Ley. Realistically your message to this morning is the same as we've heard since the last election.
SENATOR JAMES PATERSON: Well, I don't think it is. I think, what I've said is quite distinctive and that's why it's on the front page of most newspapers this morning and I think it's an important message because...
MARK LEVY: But what I mean by that James is that it's all well and good for you to stand there last night and what you say I agree with. I want to make that very, very clear but how do you as a party go out and communicate that to an electorate and to voters across Australia and say look come and vote for us, don't vote for this other mob that's sending the country down the wrong path, when you can't communicate what your policies are in the wake of an election defeat that was highly embarrassing for the Coalition.
SENATOR JAMES PATERSON: Well, it's because the defeat was so bad that we have to make sure that we get it right this time. We were rejected comprehensively and we accept and understand that, and we must go back to the drawing board, not on our fundamental values, which I think are sound and shared by Australians and capable of earning their trust and support, but by the policies which reflect those values. And I assure you and your listeners, they will not have long to wait before they have more detail about what we're proposing, and this will be a process that will continue from now until the election and we'll outline more policies and more direction as we get closer.
MARK LEVY: All right, well, James, I genuinely mean this: I think what you said last night is right. I think you're one of the more impressive members of the Liberal Party. You sit in the Senate. I think your two close friends Jacinta Nampijinpa Price and Andrew Hastie are exactly the same. We need to be leveraging powerful voices like you to boost that support for the Liberal Party because the question I asked my listeners this morning is: name me one thing that the Albanese Government has done to improve your lives? And no one's been able to give me an answer and that's the position that I think we need to sort of just come to is that we've got a government that is continuing down this path of the midst of a cost of living crisis energy policy and we're trying to make some of the most expensive electricity prices in the world we need you guys to start offering up a clear alternative and when you can do that, I think you'll stop winning back some support that's for sure and certain. Senator, keep up the good work, we'll chat soon.
SENATOR JAMES PATERSON: Thank you, mate.
MARK LEVY: That's James Paterson. Liberal Senator, Shadow Minister for Finance, Government Services, and Public Service.
ENDS