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November 6, 2025
PETER STEFANOVIC: Well folks, in The Australian this morning, the National Editor Dennis Shanahan called the Liberals the worst political performers that he'd seen in 40 years. Joining us live, the Shadow Finance Minister, James Paterson. James, hello to you. So you spoke weeks ago about ending the Apology Tour. Is this rebuild more difficult than you imagined?
SENATOR JAMES PATERSON: Pete, there's no question the Liberal Party is going through a challenging moment, but it's not surprising after the last election result that that's the case. I'm obviously not in the House of Representatives, and I wasn't there for question time, but some of the reports of the performance of question time yesterday did filter through, even to the Senate. And I thought the most interesting and telling thing was the way in which Jim Chalmers lashed out. He's normally a very cool customer, but for him to lash out in such an extraordinary way yesterday shows how much pressure he's under. I mean, he's been humiliated by the Prime Minister, forced into a backdown on his signature policy of superannuation taxation. He's had shocking economic data, and now we've got the Reserve Bank saying, forget about interest rate relief for the time being, and the next rate rise, according to market economists, may even be up, not down. Now, for the Australian people at home, that's the most important news of this week. They're already paying about $20,000 a year more than they were when Labor first came to office. And the prospect of higher rates will be a devastating blow for most families.
PETER STEFANOVIC: No, that's all true, and yeah, that is the biggest story of the week, and we covered that here, yet you're not landing a blow on the government because of your own problems and your own squabbles, so are you missing an opportunity because of that?
SENATOR JAMES PATERSON: Well, Pete, I've been very candid about this in that speech that you referred to, but also in my other interviews. We need to sort out these issues internally so that we can focus our fire on the government. This is not a government that has a good story to tell at the moment. The inflation figures last week were also devastating. Included within them was a 23.6% jump in electricity prices. Now, we will be able to scrutinise the government's failures on energy, which are manifest and significant, as soon as we lock in our own policies and positions on these issues, as soon as we're able to answer the questions that you and your colleagues have in the media about net zero. So I'm keen that we do that as expeditiously as possible.
PETER STEFANOVIC: Are you disappointed that it's taking as long as it is?
SENATOR JAMES PATERSON: Well, of course, we would have liked this to be resolved in as timely a way as possible because I don't want a bad government to get away with no scrutiny. This is not a government that will stand up well to scrutiny. This is a government that will struggle under scrutiny once we're able to apply it in a consistent, and focused, and disciplined way. And I think we can, and I'm confident we will.
PETER STEFANOVIC: Are the Liberals being led by the Nationals at the moment?
SENATOR JAMES PATERSON: No, I don't accept that. The National Party are their own independent sovereign political party, and they went through their own process to determine their position on net zero. The Liberal Party will go and is going through our own process too, and you and your viewers will not have long to wait before we're able to answer questions about exactly where we stand on those issues.
PETER STEFANOVIC: Let's get to the economy. Evan Lucas, he relayed from the RBA this week, rebates, while helpful, put a band-aid over things and just kicked economic problems down the road. So are we now paying the price for short-term thinking?
SENATOR JAMES PATERSON: Well, Ken Henry made a similar point last week. If you have to keep bailing people out, whether that's industrial smelters or household families and their budgets, with energy subsidies, then very clearly your underlying policies aren't working. And Labor's underlying energy policies are a disaster for Australians. It's not sustainable, as even the Treasurer himself has admitted, for the federal government to pay people's power bills in perpetuity or to run around the country bailing out every single heavy industry. So we've got to get those basic policy settings right. Under Labor it is not working, it's hurting families, it is hurting businesses, and it's ultimately hurting our country.
PETER STEFANOVIC: So would you be arguing against any extension of more federal rebates?
SENATOR JAMES PATERSON: You tried that last week, I think, Pete, and I'm not going to offer free advice to the Treasurer on that.
PETER STEFANOVIC: Well, we've just acknowledged that it's a problem, right? So why would you continue it?
SENATOR JAMES PATERSON: Well, what we've acknowledged is that the problem is the underlying energy policy of this government, which is failing. You know, if you listen to them in Question Time in the House or the Senate, it sounds like they're still in opposition. They're still making complaints about the previous government, but they've now been in power for three and a half years. They've got to take responsibility for what is happening on their watch. They pushed down the accelerator on the energy transition. They're the ones who set the unrealistic renewables target of 82 per cent by 2030, which no one thinks we're going to reach. They are the authors of the policy disasters that we are seeing right now, that's hurting our country.
PETER STEFANOVIC: So, on the subject of rebates, I mean, it just gets to that question of putting more and more money into the system, and it's leading to more problems long term. I mean, is that something that's going to have to stop, or because of these bigger problems, you're going to keep spending more money in terms of rebate?
SENATOR JAMES PATERSON: Well because Jim Chalmers is in such a weak position internally in the Cabinet, I suspect he probably will try and roll over the energy subsidies for a little bit longer to roll the can down the road.
PETER STEFANOVIC: Would you support that if he were to do that?
SENATOR JAMES PATERSON: A nice try again, Pete, but I'm not going to take the bait. We're the opposition. The government will be in power for at least the next two and a half years. They are responsible for what is happening in our country right now, and they have to make policy choices. But Jim Chalmers isn't going to say to Chris Bowen, mate, can we just have a bit more of a realistic rollout of renewables here? Can we just take our foot off the accelerator a bit to take the pressure off prices? Because he's got no internal authority. But the dilemma that he faces is that he and Katy Gallagher have taken the budget back into deficit. It was $12 billion last financial year. It's forecast to be $42 billion this financial year, and part of the contribution to that is those energy subsidies, which is why he's admitted that they're not sustainable forever.
PETER STEFANOVIC: Alright, we will leave it there, James Paterson, good to see you as always, though, thank you.
ENDS