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Transcripts
June 11, 2026
SALLY SARA: James Paterson, welcome back to Radio National Breakfast.
SENATOR JAMES PATERSON: Thank you for having me.
SARA: Iran's foreign ministry says diplomatic efforts with the US can't advance under repeated ceasefire violations. How precarious is this current moment in the Middle East?
PATERSON: I actually think it's remarkable that the ceasefire has held as strongly as it has for about two months now, given the extent of hostilities earlier this year. But it is clear that Iran is trying to leverage the United States to seek a more favourable deal on its terms by striking out and downing a US helicopter and also striking Israel. And it is appropriate in those circumstances, as the United State has done, for it to conduct the defensive strikes that it has.
SARA: The Foreign Minister Penny Wong and Defence Minister Richard Marles have held talks with their UK counterparts this week. We know that a House of Commons Defence Committee has cast doubt on the UK's ability to develop and deliver nuclear submarines under AUKUS. How worried are you about the UK reaching its deadlines?
PATERSON: So these concerns are about the SSN AUKUS program, which is the joint UK-Australia program to build nuclear-powered submarines that will arrive in the 2040s. It's the submarine that will ultimately replace the Virginia-class submarines we are seeking from the United States. I actually think, given that it is 15 years away, it's quite healthy to have a public debate now about what we need to do to make sure we achieve it. And the UK Labor Chair of their Defence Committee has been outspoken about their concerns about the progress that needs to be made in the UK industrial base to achieve this shared objective. We've got time to get this right. We should be open and honest about the obstacles we face, the investment that is required so that we make sure we can deliver it when we need it.
SARA: The UK and US have held inquiries into AUKUS. Would you like to see a similar investigation here in Australia?
PATERSON: I don't think we need an inquiry into whether or not we should proceed with AUKUS but I think we should have strong parliamentary oversight on how AUKUS is progressing and what needs to be done to deliver it against the milestones we've set for ourselves, including posting rotational US submarines at HMAS Stirling in Western Australia as early as next year. These are really ambitious goals and we need strong parliamentary oversight and I hope the statutory defence committee, which has recently been established, will perform that role.
SARA: You're listening to Radio National Breakfast. My guest is Shadow Defence Minister, Senator James Paterson. Senator, on domestic issues, recent polling indicates One Nation's support is increasing and its financial support is increase as well. In your view, should the Coalition do a preference deal with One Nation at the next election?
PATERSON: I think conversations about preferences now are premature. I've been involved in allocating preferences at Coalition campaign headquarters in previous elections, and you cannot make a final decision about which candidates you'll preference in each seat until you know who each of those candidates are, because some political parties, like One Nation, have demonstrated great difficulty in choosing appropriate candidates for public office in the past. I mean, as recently as the South Australian state election, One Nation endorsed someone who was wanted for crimes in the United Kingdom as a candidate and political parties generally don't want to be associated with that brand risk and have an implied endorsement by their order of preferences. So we can't make any final decisions on that until we know who the candidates are. I think our focus should be on re-earning the trust that the Liberal Party has lost in recent times from our traditional supporters before we even contemplate arrangements with any other political party.
SARA: So just so I understand, you think you'll need to wait to assess individual candidates. It's not a matter of principle, a decision that can be made long before that?
PATERSON: No, we never do deals on a national basis where we guarantee we're going to preference a particular political party in every position, in every seat. It varies around the country. It varies seat by seat. And one of the really important factors is to know who those candidates are. I don't want to find ourselves in a position of putting someone second, or third, or fourth, on our ticket who turns out to be someone who's not appropriate for public office. Pauline Hanson has publicly said she is concerned about the fact that extremists have infiltrated her political party. Now, Pauline Hanson is worried about it, I think all of us should be concerned about it. I think frankly One Nation has a lot of work to do to get themselves into a fit state to contest the election. And they need to go away to do that work and the Liberal Party shouldn't contemplate preferencing them until we've seen that that's been done.
SARA: Do you agree with your colleague Tony Pasin's suggestion reported in The Australian this morning that Liberals should strike a deal with One Nation so that the two parties don't run against each other in the same seat?
PATERSON: No, I don't. I think the Liberal Party is at its best when it aspires to represent all Australians and every Australian should have the opportunity to vote Liberal or National and we should provide that opportunity by running candidates in every single seat. I am not interested in dividing the spoils with another political party two years out from the election and frankly hitching our wagon to their brand with all the risks that that entails between now and then. Who knows what policies One Nation is going to come out with between now and then who knows what candidates they are going to endorse. Who knows how many of their MPs are going to defect or found to be have been invalidly elected between now and then. I think the Liberal Party needs to focus on earning back the trust and support of our traditional voters who we've lost before we contemplate any arrangement with any other party.
SARA: This is what Opposition Leader Angus Taylor had to say about the suggestion a short time ago, let's take a listen.
[CLIP START]
THE HON ANGUS TAYLOR MP: No, there's no plan to carve up seats. We won't be doing that. What we will be doing is focusing on a Labor government that's taking this country in the wrong direction, with higher taxes, with less houses, with immigration that has not been in line with our housing supply, and with an energy system that is broken. And that will be our focus and we won't be carving up seats.
[CLIP END]
SARA: Does it concern you that One Nation is able to raise one and a half million dollars from supporters in a single day?
PATERSON: No, political parties fundraise all the time and I think the debate this week about Labor Party fundraising and One Nation fundraising was a massive beat up. Political parties seek support from their supporters all the time so that we can finance our election campaigns. I wish other parties good luck in doing that. The Liberal Party has a strong program of fundraising for the next election.
SARA: Pauline Hanson has rejected claims One Nation Senator Tyron Whitten is ineligible to sit in Parliament. But Professor Anne Twomey says the WA Senator could be in breach of Section 44 over a family company which has contracts to help build the Snowy Hydro. Do you have concerns about Senator Whitten's eligibility?
PATERSON: I think on the face of it, Senator Whitten does have a case to answer. I think it is at least a risk that he was not validly elected because of the contracts the company he was a shareholder in had with Snowy Hydro, which is a government business enterprise. And I think, it's up to One Nation to demonstrate some leadership here. It is an option available to them to seek that he be referred to the High Court so the High Court can adjudicate this matter and put it beyond doubt.
SARA: James Paterson, thank you for joining me.
PATERSON: Thank you for having me.
ENDS